What if everything you believe about advocacy is incomplete? What if the real work of changing the world isn’t just about fixing problems, but about transforming ourselves in the process?
That’s the heart of the work of Sam Daley-Harris, Founder and Principal of Civic Courage, and author of Reclaiming Our Democracy: Every Citizen’s Guide to Transformational Advocacy.
This conversation reframes what it means to participate in democracy. It’s not just about agonizing or protesting or turning off the news. It’s about awakening to our own power and using empathy to bridge divides and build the kind of future we actually want. It’s about sharing personal stories, engaging in deep listening and conversation, and making bold asks of leaders and volunteers.
To access the episode transcript, please scroll down below.
Listen in for…
- Why sharing your “story of self” matters and how knowing your why becomes your anchor in meaningful leadership and advocacy.
- What transformational advocacy truly is, and why it has the power to change both the issues and the advocates themselves.
- The essential role of empathy in advocacy and the three questions volunteers ask when meeting with an opposing elected official that can turn conflict into connection.
- Why leaders and organizations must move past their fear of asking volunteers to do big, bold things, because that’s where transformation happens.
“Transformational advocacy is where you’re trained, encouraged, and succeed at doing things as an advocate that you never thought you could do. When you do those kinds of things, you see yourself differently.” — Sam Daley-Harris
Episode References:
- Hope for Cynics: The Surprising Science of Human Goodness by Jamil Zaki
- Citizens Climate Lobby
- Eaarth: Making a Life on a Tough New Planet by Bill McKibben
About Sam Daley-Harris, Founder, Civic Courage, and Author, Reclaiming Our Democracy:
Sam Daley-Harris started as a symphony musician and then founded the anti-poverty lobby RESULTS in 1980, co-founded the Microcredit Summit Campaign in 1995, and founded Civic Courage in 2012. The paperback edition of his book Reclaiming Our Democracy: Every Citizen’s Guide to Transformational Advocacy was named an editor’s pick by Publishers’ Weekly BookLife. Daley-Harris has been interviewed on NPR’s Here and Now and on PBS’s Laura Flanders and Friends.
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Connect with Sam:
Civic Courage: reclaimingourdemocracy.com
LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/sam-daley-harris-b8bb796
Facebook: facebook.com/sam.daleyharris
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FULL TRANSCRIPT:
Maria Ross 00:04
Welcome to the empathy edge podcast, the show that proves why cash flow, creativity and compassion are not mutually exclusive. I’m your host, Maria Ross, I’m a speaker, author, mom, facilitator and empathy advocate. And here you’ll meet trailblazing leaders and executives, authors and experts who embrace empathy to achieve radical success. We discuss all facets of empathy, from trends and research to the future of work to how to heal societal divisions and collaborate more effectively. Our goal is to redefine success and prove that empathy isn’t just good for society. It’s great for business. What if everything you believe about advocacy is incomplete? What if the real work of changing the world isn’t just about fixing problems, but about transforming ourselves in the process? That’s the heart of the work of Sam Daly Harris, founder and principal of civic courage and author of reclaiming our democracy, every Citizen’s Guide to transformational advocacy, recently revised, reimagined and named an editor’s pick by publishers. Weekly reviews have called it inspiring, persuasive and accessible, which is exactly how Sam shows up in the world. Sam didn’t begin as a policy expert. He started as a symphony musician and yet went on to launch results the anti poverty lobby in 1980 co found the global micro credit summit campaign, and later build civic courage to help leaders and volunteers become powerful, effective citizen advocates. His work has been featured on NPR and PBS, and his influence can be felt across countless movements and policy victories in our conversation, Sam reveals why sharing your story of self matters and how knowing your why becomes your anchor in meaningful leadership and advocacy, why he completely revised and released his book 30 years later, and what our current moment demands from us. He talks about what transformational advocacy truly is and why it has the power to change both the issues and the advocates themselves. He shares how organizations like results have seen real, measurable improvements on the issues they’ve championed. We then discuss the essential role of empathy and advocacy, and the three questions volunteers ask when meeting with an opposing elected official that can turn conflict into connection. And finally, we talk about why leaders and organizations must move past their fear of asking volunteers to do big, bold things, because that’s where transformation happens. This conversation reframes what it means to participate in democracy, and I hope it ignites and inspires you. It’s not just about agonizing or protesting or turning off the news. It’s about awakening to our own power and using empathy to bridge divides and build the kind of future we actually want take a listen. Welcome Sam to the empathy edge podcast. I was just telling you before we started recording that this episode is not just a bomb for my soul, but I think something that everyone needs to hear right now, in the current political climate that we’re in, and the role of empathy to help us be activists in our own comfort level, in our own way, shape or form. So welcome to the podcast. It’s great to be here. So as we do with all my guests, I would love to hear a little bit. We would all love to hear a little bit about your story and how you even got to this work, because I know that there’s an interesting turn you took, as folks heard in the bio, from a symphony musician to then an anti poverty lobbyist. So tell us about that journey and how you got here and now the author of reclaiming our democracy. Every Citizen’s Guide to transformational advocacy, tell us how you got here.
Sam Daley-Harris 04:06
So what I use to tell my story, and I tell it all the time, is a thing called the story of self, developed by Harvard Professor Marshall Ganz and it basically asks what happened in your life and What decisions did you make that got you to this commitment? So I always say when I’m telling my story, think about your what happened in your life, and what decisions have you made to get to this podcast for one so here’s mine. I have a bachelor’s degree and a master’s degree in music, and I played percussion in the Miami philharmonic orchestra for 12 years and taught high school music. And 45 years ago, I founded the anti poverty lobby. Results. A lot of times I’m asked music poverty lobby, what’s the connection when I look back in my life, there’s certainly. Experiences that start pointing me in a different direction. The death of a friend around high school graduation in 1964 and the assassination of US Senator Robert Kennedy around college graduation in 1968 got me to asking the questions of purpose. Why am I here? What am I here to do? What’s my purpose? Nine years later, it’s now 1977 I’m invited to a presentation on ending world hunger, put on by the Hunger Project. And I go to this event thinking, well, hunger’s inevitable. What do I know? I’m a musician. I’m thinking, well, it’s inevitable because there must be no solutions. Again, what do I know? Because if there were solutions, somebody would have done something by now. But I go to this event and it’s obvious right away there’s no mystery to growing food, clean water, basic health literacy. I’m not hopeless about the perceived lack of solutions. I’m hopeless about human nature. People will just never get around to doing the things that can be done. But there’s one human nature. I have some control over my own and my questions. Why am I here? What am I here to do? So I get involved in a big way. This is the end of the story. In 1978 and 1979 I spoke to 7000 high school students, classroom by classroom on ending world hunger. And before I went into the first classrooms, I went read some statements from Jimmy Carter’s commission on world hunger, calling for the political will to end hunger. And so I asked 7000 high school students, what’s the name of your member of Congress? I don’t want to know if you wrote them. I don’t want to know if you met. Just the name out of 7000 asked 200 fewer than 3% could answer correctly. 6800 over 97% could not tell me the name of their member of Congress. And results grew out of this gap between the calls for the political will to end hunger on the one hand and the lack of basic information on who represented us in Washington on the other. And let me just add these high school students are in their 60s now. Oh, wow. And so I always say I had a front row seat on the American slumber party. And by my little poll back in 1978 79 Wow.
Maria Ross 07:35
And what do you mean by the American slumber party?
Sam Daley-Harris 07:38
Well, let me say it a different way in the last election, in November 2025 in New York City, Zoran Mamdani was elected. It was the largest voter turnout in since 1969 and 58% of registered New York voters didn’t vote. And we’re we should rightfully celebrate that it was the largest turnout since 1969
Maria Ross 08:07
and yeah, and still it’s less than 50% Yeah.
Sam Daley-Harris 08:10
And a little more recently, in December 2025 there was a new mayor from Miami. It’s a first Democrat elected in 30 years, and the voter turnout was 21% that’s the American Slumber Party indeed. Yes. And so anyway, that’s what I mean. Yeah.
Maria Ross 08:31
I mean it is. It’s a travesty to me when we think about the sacrifices and people literally putting their lives on the line to get us the right to vote in this country, and the fact that people don’t go, and I know a lot of it is people feel jaded. They feel that they’re it’s voter apathy. They feel that it doesn’t matter the system is rigged. Or, you know, my one vote won’t matter, but it’s, you know, I often think to myself, do we need to become a country where it’s compulsory, like where we’re making everybody vote, but that just seems so antithetical to democracy, to really getting people to activate and understand the part they play in the larger fabric of everything that’s going on. And that’s really, you know, the work of empathy and compassion is sort of being self aware that it’s not just about you, there are other people and that you are part of a community, and you’re part of an ecosystem, and you don’t always have all the right answers, and so you know, really getting together and forming that collective. So I want to talk about your book, reclaiming our democracy. Now this is actually a rewrite, a revision, from a book that you wrote 30 years ago. So why were you compelled to update it and release it in the past year?
Sam Daley-Harris 09:46
I want to tell the story. I was interviewed in early 2024 when the hardback came out on a national NPR program goes to 350 stations, and I was totally blown away by. How vulnerable the host was, and I’m going to, I’ve memorized, I’m going to repeat his question to me, and then my response. He said, The passive nature to our politics today. You can feel beat down by it. This is national radio. You can feel beat down by it. I mean, this is my career, and I feel beat down by it. I don’t participate the same way others do, because I’m a political journalist, but I do have to pay attention. It’s a grind. It’s a grind. Sam, I mean, I know you know that, what am I feeling? What is the way out of that? I was so blown away by his vulnerability in that question. The first thing I said was, well, Apollo astronaut, Rusty Schweickart said, we aren’t passengers on spaceship Earth. We’re the crew. Well, are we? And if we’re crew, how does crew operate? And the same thing. Second thing I said was futurists and climate activists. Alex Stephen said, in fact, these days, cynicism is obedience. Well, yeah, if I’m cynical, I’m obedient to wasting I’m not going to do anything. Why would I? If nothing I do makes a difference? If I could add one more that I didn’t know at the time, I’ve since met this professor at Stanford, Jamil
Maria Ross 11:23
Zaki, yes, who wrote, familiar with his work, hope
Sam Daley-Harris 11:26
for cynics, the surprising science of human goodness. I love that title. And in the book, he says, Well, if you’re cynical, it’s like you’re playing poker, and you fold your hand before the game even starts. Well, if we’re civic Syndicate, cynics, it’s kind of like we fold our hand before the Congress is sworn in, before the first bill is introduced. So it was a great that’s my that interview was like in my face. Reason why I wanted to have the book rewritten and updated,
Maria Ross 12:01
yes and re released, yes. And you know, your main idea and your main focus is around transformational advocacy. So what is that? And give us an example from your book, because, you know, we’re going to connect the dots for folks here about how this links to strengthening your empathy, and why empathy is required, not only to navigate change, but to navigate disagreement and navigate conflict in a constructive way. So tell us what you mean by transformational advocacy.
Sam Daley-Harris 12:33
Okay, great, so I’m going to tell what it’s not. It’s not transactional advocacy. Sign the petition. Transaction complete transformational advocacy is where you’re trained, encouraged and succeed at doing things as an advocate that you never thought you could do, like meet with a member of Congress and bring them on board to your issue. And when you do those kinds of things, you see yourself differently. That’s the transformation and who you see yourself to be. And an example, let me see if I can remember this one great quote from her. I’m going to tell the story of Ellie sparks. She was a volunteer when she told me the story with Citizens Climate Lobby. Now she’s on staff. She said when she joined CCl, she was suffering from what she called Climate trauma. She would read Bill mckibben’s book Earth, and she would weep at home, and she would weep at work. And then she joined Citizens Climate Lobby, and she gets trained, and she meets, and there’s this one spade of four days where she meets with 20 congressional offices, and this is what she said, and this is a transformational part. She said, going into their offices was hard. I had to let go of a lot of emotional baggage. I could no longer judge them or hold hostility in my heart toward them. I had to let go of my fear of climate change and my fear that they wouldn’t listen to me. I had to center myself in love, releasing fear and centering in love. This is sacred and profound work. End of quote. Well, she started at climate trauma and she ended at Sacred and profound right. That is that transformation right of who she really saw herself to be in the matter
Maria Ross 14:33
well, and it’s amazing what happens when you empower people in big and small ways, is it changes their self view. It changes their ability to think they can’t to they can. And we see it in the workplace all the time, with workers who are not trusted to, you know, they’re told what to do, and it’s like, okay, I’m just going to do this and I’m not going to be engaged, because maybe this is all I’m meant for, versus workers who are like, hey, what’s the goal? Well, you figure it out. What are your ideas? What are your innovations, and how people light up when you give them the opportunity to be heard, when you give them the opportunity to see themselves in a different way, we lose so I feel we lose so much potential of so many human beings when we put them in environments where they feel they have no no option, no say, no autocracy.
Sam Daley-Harris 15:23
Well, if I could add this in the nonprofit volunteer world, I’m going to tell a story where it’s a little even worse than that. Yeah, talking to the head of organizing for a very large every one of your viewers and listeners would know the name of this organization, which I’m not going to say, net of organizing, said to me, we can’t let our volunteers write letters to the editor or op eds, because they’ll get it wrong and misrepresent the organization. Protecting their brand was more important than than training their members. And I always say, well, one of the groups I coach, I mentioned earlier, Citizens Climate Lobby, the year before covid, their volunteers had 4300 letters to the editor, op eds and editorials published in 2019 one group was saying they’ll get it wrong and misrepresent the organization. Citizens Climate lobbies, saying, Well, what do we have to do to help them get it right? Right? Yes, add to them. And as a result, they had those 4300 published pieces.
Maria Ross 16:31
This is very similar. I do some work with Moms Demand Action around common sense, gun safety and against gun violence. And I attended for the first time, an advocacy day at the California State Capitol last March. It was so empowering to be there and to be in those offices, and just the numbers, just the strength in numbers of showing up, and they train the volunteers that are the team leads. So you’re put on a team, and you go to a few offices with that team, and there’s a lead there that’s guiding the conversation. Those people are trained by the organization. They’re not political lobbyists. They’re not, you know, in this world, they’re just, they’re moms, they’re women, they’re people that have been impacted by gun violence, and, yeah, they’re us. And then the organization says, We’ll train you on how to run this, what to say, but they always stress the most important thing is you share your story. You share why you’re there. That’s going to matter more than any list of talking points that we have because they already know we’re there to support to ask them to support a certain bit of legislation. What they can’t replicate is the individual stories that will maybe touch that lawmaker in a way where they can be moved to action and they have the faith and the trust in the people that are volunteering without having to vet them necessarily, without, you know, it’s just like, hey, I just showed up. They didn’t know me, and they’re like, share why you’re here. Why are you even involved with this organization? Share that with the lawmaker, and I just thought that was such a what does this mean to you exactly, and I just thought that was such a great way to proliferate evangelism and also to create empathy of just tell your personal story about what this means to you and let them see you as a person, not a quote, unquote activist, not a rabble rouser, not, you know, an annoyance in their day, but as an actual person.
Sam Daley-Harris 18:26
Yeah, brilliant, brilliant. Maybe I could just let your audience know when I’m talking to a group. And in mid December of 2025, I did my 120/4 in person, or Zoom talk, not counting this kind of podcast, I always say, look for three things if you’re looking for an organization that’s working to deliver transformational advocacy. One, recruitment and community building, the organization brings new people in, not just to build an E blast list, but to form them into local chapters, so you’re not working alone, and the community building might include a monthly whole of organization webinar with guest speakers and Q and A and inspiration. So recruitment and community building too. What you were just talking about, training. How do you get the meeting with the elected How do you plan for the meeting? What do you ask for in the meeting? How do you write a letter to the editor? Two, training. Three, the organization encourages breakthroughs. Encourages you to move out of your comfort zone and do because that’s where confidence comes from when you’re encouraged to do things you didn’t think you could do. And in the book, there’s this drawing on one side, there’s a small circle labeled your comfort zone, and next to it is a much larger circle labeled where the magic happens. So you’re looking for an organization like you mentioned. Moms Demand Action that’s not kicking. You out, encouraging you out of your comfort zone, over to where the magic happens,
Maria Ross 20:05
for sure, for sure. And you know, obviously you’ve talked before and in the book about how we’re talking about transformational advocacy, and how it transforms the volunteers that are associated with these different causes. So what are some of the issues that results the organization that you created and other groups have worked on what have been some of the issues that have been improved by this kind of transformational advocacy? And I’m sure there’s a lot, so maybe just highlight one or two.
Sam Daley-Harris 20:34
Let me I’m going to give it. One example is results has worked for 41 years on child survival globally, where the UN Children’s Fund UNICEF, was reporting 40,000 child deaths a day around the world in 1983 and now we’ve worked for 41 years, it’s fallen by 66% the global child death rate now our current president, and Elon Musk brought a chainsaw to some of that work. But I want to tell folks about one example of a glimmer of hope for the fiscal year 2026 which is the bulk of the year. 2026 Maternal and Child Health was funded at $915 million and President Trump called for a 92% cut to 85 million. Will the House Appropriations Committee not the Democrat? The House Appropriations Committee appropriated the full $915 million that’s because citizens have spent years and decades educating their members of Congress on that, and now it goes to the Senate, etc. But I’ll tell you one other one of the groups I’m coaching is the United Church of Christ, climate hope affiliates, and they’re working on the Environmental Protection Agency. Well, the President called for a 55% cut to the Environmental Protection Agency for 2026 and the house called for 23% cut, and the Senate called for a 5% cut. Now most of us don’t know about that. Actually, this organization I mentioned, they only started in 2025 so they only have 11 chapters, so they’re mostly writing letters to the editor, urging the public to call their members of Congress and push for no cut or the 5% the President’s 50. So there’s those are examples, not only change that we can make, but some of the groups and the changes they’re working on making these kinds of issues
Maria Ross 22:49
so it’s so heartening, because we want to encourage participation by showing progress. And sometimes the progress is immediate, sometimes it takes a little longer. And I just want to talk about, you know, the role of empathy in this work, to me, is obvious, this idea of getting together, seeing other perspectives, so that we can find common ground and influence our lawmakers in whatever advocacy we choose to support. So when you’re coaching volunteers who are meeting with an elected official who opposes a bill, maybe that they support. You have them ask three questions, and can you share what those questions are, why they’re important, and an example of why they work?
Sam Daley-Harris 23:32
Yes, these are our curiosity questions. Okay, these are our deep listening questions. So I’m coaching a group. They’re going to go meet with a member of Congress who opposes their bill. Question number one, we know you don’t support this bill. What would it take to change your mind? And you’re listening for assignments. I’ll tell a little story in a moment. What would it take to change your mind? Two, Could you say more about that? Three, why do you think that is it’s basically a deep listening exercise. Yeah, I have a friend in Pennsylvania, and he is years ago, he was going down to Florida. He wanted to start a house Climate Solutions caucus Democrats and Republicans, and he was meeting with a Republican, and he said, What would it take to change your mind? And she said, Well, if you could get the Chambers of Commerce on board, there’s his assignment. And he did. He got letters from the presidents of the miami miami beach, Coral Gables, North Chambers of Commerce. He comes back with the letters of support, and the congresswoman says, Well, if you could get the mayor’s on board, here’s his compassion and action, because he’s listening to what she’s Amy did, Miami, Miami Beach, North Miami Coral Gables. He comes back with letters from these mayors. And so that’s an example of curiosity. What is it on their side of the. Conversation that they need, yeah, and then his compassion and action, doing something about what they said would help change things. And so, yeah, it’s quite astounding. And I’ll just say that when it was started in 2016 grew to 10 Republicans and 10 Democrats. President Trump was elected the first time, and it fell to six and six because it was Noah’s Ark. A Democrat would only come on with a Republican. He grew to six and six because some had been defeated or retired at the end of the second year of President Trump’s first term. It had grown to 45 Republicans and 45 Democrats. And this is what group Well, this was the house Climate Solutions caucus. Got it helps of Representatives. Now, some of this was whitewashing and but some folks were serious these members of the House of Representatives. And, yeah, it’s basically a story of kind of doing the early spade work, right? No one thought it was possible, right?
Maria Ross 26:07
Well, we’re never going to cut through by shaming and blaming, right? Which, which feels good in the moment, to feel, you know, self righteous and attack a lawmaker that you don’t agree with, but it’s not going to get you anywhere. And so, you know, I write, I write my lawmaker a lot about different issues. And I’ve also written when he’s done something I agree with. And I’ve said, I know I often write you when I’m not happy with something, but I’m happy with this, like, this was a great move. Thank you. And remembering that, yes, whatever, some of them are motivated by greed. Some of them are motivated by their party, and maybe they don’t have and both sides the aisle, let me just be clear. Maybe they don’t have a moral center, but most people do. Most people get into public service. No one would want that life unless they were committed. And again, we know that different people have different motivations, but if we can remember to treat them with respect and with and as a human being like you were saying earlier, and those curiosity questions, again, empathy does not have to mean you agree with someone. It just means you make space to actually hear them out and listen to their point of view, so that you maybe can find common ground like, oh, to your point, you know? Oh, what’s stopping you? What was stopping me is, I don’t want to make enemies of the chambers of commerce, so I need to get them on board. Great. Let me find a way to get them on board, right, so you have a much more productive conversation. And whether you’re in the workplace or you’re dealing with government, it’s human dynamics of just getting curious about that other point of view.
Sam Daley-Harris 27:43
Let me tell this other story. In this whole scheme of things, in September 2025 the 25 volunteers with Citizens Climate Lobby had a three and a half hour hike with their Republican Senator John Curtis, who took Mitt Romney’s seat in the Senate. And it started in 2017 when he was a first year House member, and he announced an eight hour town hall meeting hike. And eight people showed up, six from this Citizens Climate Lobby. And the next year, again, it was a great turnout. I don’t know that I could do an eight hour hike, but anyway,
Maria Ross 28:25
yeah, not accessible to everyone, but yeah, personal hike.
Sam Daley-Harris 28:28
And on the first hike, someone said, What are you going to do about carbon? And he said, I thought, well, I was the mayor of Provo Utah. I never thought about carbon and, you know? And he said, because they didn’t attack me, right? And they just like, you know, I would take a baby step, and they would, you know, recognize that, etc. A couple of years later, he founded the conservative climate Caucus in the House of Representatives. In the end of 2024 that that Congress, and then he went to the Senate. There were 87 Republicans in the conservative climate caucus, yes, right, some of them BS, but some of them serious, right, right. We need to anyway. I just was, and I’ll add this, that hike was just miles six miles from where Charlie Kirk was murdered on that campus. And so here you have 25 volunteers hiking with their Republican senator for three and a half hours, right? And then you have the heinous crime six miles away within weeks of wow, yeah. So I mean, one gives me
Maria Ross 29:41
hope, yeah, and one is a cautionary tale. Yeah, we want to go Right exactly. So last question I have for you is that you often say that if you want transformational advocacy to work, organizations and their staff have to get over their fear of making big asks of. Volunteers. What do you mean by that?
Sam Daley-Harris 30:02
Well, let me say it this way, when I’m coaching an organization to start a chapter, let’s say there are 20 people in the room, and 10 raise their hand and be in the new chapter. They start with a four part new group training every week for four weeks for 90 minutes of training. If it’s a new staffer, they’re gonna No one’s gonna agree to four part new group training that’s asking a lot of people. I’ll just water it down or kind of slough over the Yeah, no, you need to make big asks of volunteers. And yeah, I just got an email last couple of days, this group that I’d mentioned just start their first 11 chapters. And this one chapter in Michigan, their congressional office had been shut down because of vandalism to the outside, and they had a meeting with the Chief of Staff, and they were only going to be informed where the meeting would be a few hours before they worried, would this really even happen, right? And then they meet with the chief of staff in the district office, and they’re blown away. He keeps them for an hour. He wants their input, you know? And this is in an office that so many others thought. They don’t respond, they don’t pay attention, right? They’re not responsive. Well, yeah, but they had this four part new group training, and they learned how to get the meeting, and they learned how to practice for the meeting, right, you know? And it just shifted things for them.
Maria Ross 31:36
And I think that’s like the call to action. And, you know, anything actionable you can share with us about how can listeners who do want to get involved but they don’t know what groups offer good training, what groups have those four points that you mentioned, and obviously they want to get involved with causes they care about, right? But I know people are often like, I don’t know where to go. I don’t know what to do, you know? So can you give us some action oriented
Sam Daley-Harris 32:00
I describe the groups that will feed you power, yes, and if people go to my website, reclaiming our democracy.com, and on the homepage of reclaiming our democracy.com, is a button to learn more. It’s really a sign up sheet, and you can let me know that you would like me to connect you with any one of five different groups, and I urge you to pick one, not five, right? Complicated that way, right? And if you go to reclaiming our democracy.com and click on Learn More, you’re going to then let me know you’d like to be connected with this group or that group. If you’d like me to speak to your club or whatever.
Maria Ross 32:43
I love that. I love that. And we should just add, you know, because I do have an international audience, we should add, we’re talking about the United States. Do you do any work out with organizations outside
Sam Daley-Harris 32:54
Britain and Okay, elsewhere. So there’s some other possibilities.
Maria Ross 32:59
Great, great. Well, Sam, this has been so heartening to me, and so a little spark of optimism and hopefulness and what are some dark times right now? And it all comes back to the way that we relate to each other as human beings, and how we can leverage empathy and making sure that that we’re coming into things with a assuming positive intent and not having so much of our own stuff or maybe our own bad past experiences with advocacy get in the way of moving forward with advocacy where we are now. So thank you so much for sharing all of this. I you know, I usually ask at this point, because we’re going to put all the links to what you talked about in the show notes, as well as your book, which, again, the name of the book, is reclaiming our democracy, every Citizen’s Guide to transformational advocacy, which was named an editor’s pick by Publishers Weekly, by the way, but we’ll put a link to that. But I know you have already shared with us that the best place to go is to go to reclaiming our democracy. If you’re interested in getting involved, click that Learn More button and Sam will connect you with an organization that you can feel good about and be empowered by. So thank you for your insights. Thank you for your work. Thank you. It’s a thrill to talk with you, and thank you everyone for listening to another episode of the empathy edge podcast. If you like what you heard, you know what to do. Please rate, review and share it with a friend or a colleague, and until next time, please remember that cash flow, creativity and compassion are not mutually exclusive. Take care and be kind For more on how to achieve radical success through empathy. Visit the empathy edge.com there you can listen to past episodes, access show notes and free resources. Book me for a Keynote or workshop and sign up for our email list to get new episodes, insights, news and events. Please follow me on Instagram at Red slice. Marie. Up. Never forget, empathy is your superpower. Use it to make your work and the world a better place.
